IMO, Most "Neg" Bareback Bottoms Are Poz
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29 January 2008 | 12 Comments
The other night there was a party listed on BarebackRT.com – the “neg” gangbang bottom I had fucked twice last year (1, 2) listed himself as being at a private club “with ass in the air for all nasty top breeders”. Now I’ve watched his profiles and posts on Craigslist over the past year and almost without a fault he says he’s neg and looking for neg tops. He’s consistent which is one of the ways I’ve tried to figure out if bottoms are really neg.
But the last time I fucked him there were guys fucking him who looked pretty poz to me. Yeah, I know you can’t always tell, but please… The guy’s there with a blindfold on letting as many guys as possible cum in his ass for over two hours…
This time the first guy on his approved list of party attendees was a guy who’s profile said he was a poz versatile bottom, and when I inquired about the party it was at one of the sex clubs downtown that was previously said to be closed, but apparently now open from time to time… He’s obviously not screening the tops – he’s just laying ass up taking all the loads he can get – and given the crowd most of them are poz. Yet his profile says he’s neg and he’s looking for “neg only”. I just don’t get that – he’d get more loads if he dropped the “neg only” part…
Then there’s the latin bottom who told me he took a 110 loads last year at MAL. Whether you believe the number or not, once again he’s an anonymous bottom who advertises constantly on Craigslist and it’s safe to say he’s getting a lot of cum in his ass. Yet his Manhunt profile says he’s neg.
Then there was the bottom near where I used to work who answered a direct question before I hooked up with him the first time and said he was neg. Then later backtracked and said “that’s a scary question” when I asked him again a few months later.
Then there was the guy I talked to online who’s Manhunt profile said he was neg, but who quickly told me he was actually poz – that he just didn’t want friends knowing he was poz. At least he was up front about it…
Then there was the poz guy who said he only liked to hookup with neg tops because he thought he was less likely to get STDs…
The scenarios go on and on…
So I’ve come to the conclusion that most “neg” bb bottoms are actually poz. Well, at least the ones who are actively barebacking. Sure there are some who I think are genuinely neg, but they tend to be so skittish about hooking up that it’s rare for me to actually fuck one of them. When I do get to fuck one, they tend to be in relationships and hooking up with guys they think are neg… The Brazilian guy falls into that category. Or they’ve been fantasizing about taking a load and I’m one of their first raw loads – ’cause they’re trying to experiment “safely”.
While I’d love to think serosorting is the answer for me, the fact of the matter is that it just doesn’t provide enough bottoms to fuck. I mean the other night I was trying to hookup with two different neg bottoms and both of them fell through, which didn’t surprise me at all. Compare that to poz bottoms which will come right over as soon as you ask.
Even when I’m asking bottoms if they’re neg, I wind up fucking poz bottoms. So yeah, I’ll continue to go out of my way to fuck guys I think are genuinely HIV negative – but frankly, since I’m fucking poz bottoms one way or the other, I’ve stopped ruling out bottoms just because they say they’re poz – after all that’s just punishing them for being honest and rewarding the ones that lie. Plus, there are some really hot poz bottoms out there who are incredible fucks – for some guys once they test poz they seem to really crave taking loads which takes the sexual energy up a few notches…
My risk might be a little higher now, but I’m still OK with my level of risk and won’t freak out if I become poz. I’ll probably just get tested every 6 months or so instead of every year just to do a better job of protecting a few of the neg bottoms who are taking my cum…
Now a word to the true neg bottoms out there. There have been two neg bottoms that I’ve known about who I’ve fucked and a few years later wound up getting stealth bred. In one case the guy just lied. In the other case it was an occasional fuck buddy who knew he became poz, knew the bottom was neg, didn’t say anything, and continued to fuck him. In other words, it’s not just poz bottoms who are lying about their status.
I got a lot of heat for my post saying a cum-addicted young neg bottom might think about getting himself pozzed with a mild strain of HIV – but honestly, given what I’ve seen, I don’t think there are a lot of other realistic options out there for someone who really feels the urge to get cum in his ass on a regular basis.
To the other neg bottoms who bareback now and then… I don’t want to make you even more skittish than you already are (you’re hard enough to hookup with in the first place), but just be aware of what you’re doing and be comfortable with your decisions.
Then there’s the neg bottom, in a relationship, who describes himself as “not a bug chaser” who wants me to arrange lots of tops (including poz tops) to fuck him at IML… But that’s a subject for another post…
CLARIFICATION:
A reader wrote me and said the following:
hey there. i really like reading your blog and have been for a while. i see alot of my self in ur blog. i have noticed over the last 6 months or so u have seem to have becum a lot more relaxed. ur not as scared as poz. the same with me. i agree with what u told those neg bttms.
i also get the sense ur ready to convert. u won’t chase but ur ready to move things up to the next level where the chances r better. i know i have. i also think about what it is like to be a poz top shooting that poz load.
Let me make this clear – my level of risk hasn’t changed all that much. 10+ years ago I’d bareback guys who laid on their stomachs in their rooms at bathhouses – probably 5 or 6 a week – in hindsight, most of them were poz. I’m still doing similar stuff now – only more 1-on-1 which actually lowers my risk because I’m not hooking up with multiple guys per night – more like 1 or 2 a week (or less). And some of the guys I hookup with really are neg – which lowers my risk even further.
So things may have changed over the past 4 or 5 years, but they’re just back closer to where they were 10 years ago.
And I’m definitely not “ready to convert”. In fact I expect I’ll be neg for quite a while longer…
UPDATE:
One other important point one of the reader comments made me realize I’d left out of the post… Guys are a lot more infectious right after they convert than they are years later when they’re on meds. From that perspective barebacking neg bottoms is a bit more of a minefield than you might expect. Sure, most of the time your risk is near zero (if they’re really neg), but then you get the one who doesn’t know he just converted who’s super-infectious. Long-term poz guys on meds with low viral loads are just a constant, low level of risk… To me it seems like a bit of a toss up, and I’m not certain, when all’s said and done, that I’m taking that much more risk barebacking poz bottoms.
UPDATE #2:
A panel of experts in Switzerland has come out with the statement that you can’t get HIV by having sex with a poz person who has an undetectable viral load and no STDs. So the irony after this whole post is that some poz guys are effectively neg. And in some cases it’s no big deal that the poz guys are saying they’re neg, ’cause it’s as safe to have sex with them as it is with a neg guy.
But one way or the other it definitely confirms “update #1” and my being OK with barebacking at least some poz guys…
I have read that even though, doctors afraid that cross contamination would become common, it hasn’t happend in the numbers that first thought. The article I was reading speculated that people become more resistant after an initial infection since there is commonality in all strains. NOT TO SAY IT DOESN’T HAPPEN just that it is rare. I wish I had the article because it would add weight to the point I think you were making.
From looking at ads on bareback sites, I agree. Lots of times I see “neg seeking neg/any” ads that turn into “poz seeking any” – and then often to “neg seeking any” (often with a name change, but I recognize the pics). Plus for every time I see that there must be dozens of guys that never have an honest stage or where I don’t recognize the new profile. Then there are guys with multiple profiles, some of which are “neg” and some are “don’t know”.
“Neg seeking any” versatiles or bottoms are fairly high-risk anyway. People are most infectious when they’re converting and anybody taking loads casually has a meaningful risk of just having caught it. Weigh in that they’re extra contagious then and they’re probably not much lower risk than a poz guy.
“Neg seeking neg” seems usually honest. But even there, I’ve seen exceptions.
ropenrideu – What you said reminded me of something I forgot to say in the post – that I’m at less risk barebacking a poz bottom who’s on meds than a “neg” bottom who just converted. I think I may update the main body of the post since it’s a pretty important point.
I had always taken “neg seeking neg” pretty seriously – until this week and the “neg” gangbang bottom taking loads at the sex club…
My comment should have been more clear since it was only pertinent to your;
“I got a lot of heat for my post saying a cum-addicted young neg bottom might think about getting himself pozzed with a mild strain of HIV – but honestly, given what I’ve seen, I don’t think there are a lot of other realistic options out there for someone who really feels the urge to get cum in his ass on a regular basis.”
Next time I’ll try and follow the thread a bit closer.
I recall an estimate that something like 1/3 of infections occur immediately after infection, i.e. before seroconversion. The exact risk depends on the fraction of neg guys partners which have already seroconverted, but this suggests even if you did an onspot test the risk is still perhaps 1/4 of the risk with a poz guy. That’s still probably significant risk for the top and unacceptable risk for a bottom. A bottom would also need to be fairly certain the top hadn’t taken unsafe loads since about 1 month before his last test.
And this assumes you know the guy’s current status. As we all agree, a lot of guys lie like rugs, especially bottoms.
ropenrideu – I think you’re pulling those numbers out of your ass… Plus they just don’t make any sense.
Let’s try to be a bit more factual. There’s been enough avoidance of real data by the condom nazis – we don’t need more of it here…
I’ll try to look the numbers up. But I’m quite sure the percentage of people estimated to have caught HIV from a very recently converted guy is substantial. That means the risk from a “neg” guy is nontrivial. Any estimate of relative risk will be pretty speculative because the fraction of sexual encounter involving poz guys isn’t really measureable.
I personally don’t think most neg bb bottoms are poz, though certainly some are. I mean, lots of us were in that positions at one time and verifiably remained neg for many years. Some, of course, were neg years ago and haven’t bothered to check recently.
But I do think that some guys who say “neg” or “neg looking for neg only” are in fact neg and WANT guys to stealth them. Not all, but definitely some of them are.
As a neg bottom that loves to get fucked bareback I say it is possible for mim to be neg. I have been fucked by numerous poz tops. I am still testing neg. That’s not to say that there aren’t poz bottoms claiming to be negative.
Neg bottom looking to be pizzed
I’ve had raw sex with more men then I honestly should have . I’ve done a number of risky things anon gh etc.. . Everytime I get tested (which is regularly ) it comes back neg. I don’t know how or why honestly am shocked each time . I’m at a point where some people like your self assume I’m lying but just recently tested neg again. Who knows but you can’t assume anything especially since some people are just naturally resistant to viral infections. The only std I’ve ever caught was bacterial and was treated.